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 Post subject: Starter and Starter Rebuild
PostPosted: 04 Feb 2019 12:00 
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Skipper

Joined: 09 Jul 2008 12:51
Posts: 232
My starter has been getting a bit tired over the past few years... I have a couple of questions...

1. If I order a new starter, just exactly what model and specs do you recommend? Where to order ? Keeping in mind the cogs much match.

2. If I rebuild the starter,,,, If I did it myself, where would I buy the rebuild kit and does anyone out there have instructions for the rebuild? Perhaps all I need is a new starter solenoid ?

I have someone local that sells and rebuilds starters locally but I wanted to cross this ground first....

cheers,


 
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 Post subject: Re: Starter and Starter Rebuild
PostPosted: 04 Feb 2019 13:20 
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Skipper

Joined: 29 Dec 2006 09:38
Posts: 520
What makes you think you need to rebuild it? I had my Westerbeast for 15 years and put 3000+ hours on it in all manner of conditions. When I cruised Central America for a couple years, I carried and used a lot of spares (raw and fresh water pumps, spare alternator and regulator, etc) but I did not carry an alternator—figuring that these are not complicated to rebuild because they are essentially (except for the marine solenoid in some models) basically the same as many truck engines. Although I suport owners replacing stuff and keeping a healthy supply of important spares a good idea if you are starting an extended cruise or long relationship with a boat, I think one could go overboard. I did in some cases. My only rigging failure was a recent replacement, for instance. The Westerbekes, or any of these “marinized” small diesels have weaknesses mostly in their cooling and exhaust systems that need to be carefully evaluated, monitored and maintained. And it is great to take stuff apart so you know how it goes together to be self sufficient. I bought a solenoid for my starter in an auto parts store in Panama—right off the shelf. I could not tell the difference from anything on the outside from the one I replaced.
FWIW.
Ray


 
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 Post subject: Re: Starter and Starter Rebuild
PostPosted: 04 Feb 2019 14:33 
Offline
Skipper

Joined: 09 Jul 2008 12:51
Posts: 232
The engine has been harder to start little by little for the past two years. I'm pretty sure it's the starter... the same starter the boat had since it was new in 1981. It's the only thing I haven't replaced on the engine over the years. I have the same symptoms that one of the previous posts where a guy had a W50 for sale. When he rebuilt the starter the motor fired right up.

Having a W50 for over 12 years I have learned to replace or rebuilt just about everything on my own. If the cost of a new one is low enough I'd rather buy one that screw with a rebuild... and have it fail in a year.

But thanks for your history... not much of it helps me though,,, How did you know your starter solenoid was the problem? a total Starter failure ?

So I ask again,,,,
1. If I order a new starter, just exactly what model and specs do you recommend? Where to order ? Keeping in mind the cogs much match.

2. If I rebuild the starter,,,, If I did it myself, where would I buy the rebuild kit and does anyone out there have instructions for the rebuild? Perhaps all I need is a new starter solenoid ?


 
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 Post subject: Re: Starter and Starter Rebuild
PostPosted: 05 Feb 2019 07:24 
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Skipper

Joined: 21 Oct 2006 15:36
Posts: 265
Mike-

I'll be happy to provide answers to your questions later today. I'm away from my home computer where most of the info you'd like resides.

_________________
Jim Voelxen
Odyssey #191
Home Port: Osterville, MA


 
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 Post subject: Re: Starter and Starter Rebuild
PostPosted: 05 Feb 2019 09:40 
Offline
Skipper

Joined: 09 Jul 2008 12:51
Posts: 232
Jim, many thanks,,,,, you can post it on the forum or send it to me via email...
my email address is threepointfix (at) gmail.com


 
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 Post subject: Re: Starter and Starter Rebuild
PostPosted: 05 Feb 2019 20:26 
Offline
Skipper

Joined: 14 Jul 2012 20:36
Posts: 342
Had my rebuilt, by a local auto electric shop, usually starters give you a little warning. I'm thinking the correct part numbers for a W50 starter is. They all cross over.

Lucas

26371
26371A
26371E
26400
27431
27431A

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Hull #208, Puff Card
Southern Chesapeake Bay


 
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 Post subject: Re: Starter and Starter Rebuild
PostPosted: 06 Feb 2019 07:15 
Offline
Skipper

Joined: 21 Oct 2006 15:36
Posts: 265
Mike-

Sorry about not posting my reply yet. I'm away from home and have tried 3 times but I've lost my reply as I was switching back from my cell to my tablet. When I get home, I'll post a full reply. My stater was a Lucas M45G. Number was stamped on the body. I bought a rebuild kit from www.aspwholesale.com. Part no. LU-79-1102. It had all the parts I needed. I've attached an exploded view of the starter. Mine failed because the rear shaft bushing was worn, which what you'd expect from over use. Wasn't hard to replace.

As an aside, your symptoms may be caused by your glow plugs. They are wired in series and if one or more have failed, it will make it more difficult to start.


Attachments:
Lucas Model M45G Exploded View 001.jpg
Lucas Model M45G Exploded View 001.jpg [ 1.16 MB | Viewed 0 times ]

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Jim Voelxen
Odyssey #191
Home Port: Osterville, MA
 
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 Post subject: Re: Starter and Starter Rebuild
PostPosted: 06 Feb 2019 12:58 
Offline
Skipper

Joined: 09 Jul 2008 12:51
Posts: 232
Jim, thanks... the glow plugs were the first thing I replaced. Some days the engine turns over really quick,,, other days it acts like the batteries are dead it's so sluggish... (by the way I have new batteries too).

thanks


 
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 Post subject: Re: Starter and Starter Rebuild
PostPosted: 06 Feb 2019 14:56 
Offline
Skipper

Joined: 21 Oct 2006 15:36
Posts: 265
Those could be the symptoms of worn bushings. My starter worked fine. Went to start it the next morning. It cranked over slowly. I knew battery bank 1 was going bad so I assumed it was the problem. Paralleled it with bank 2. Tried to start again. Heard an immediate clunk. Then the engine acted as if it were seized. Root cause after disassembling the starter: worn rear bushing, assume it was worn so much that the rotor was contacting the stator causing it to seize. Turned out to be an easy fix.

Anyway, I'm not home yet but I'll try to provide a complete answer to the question of purchasing a new vs rebuilding a starter. I learned a lot when I had my starter issue and I'd like to have all learn from my experience. The bottom line, which I had to learn, was: starters are robust, the parts that generally fail are available and cheap, and the rebuild process is not hard.

_________________
Jim Voelxen
Odyssey #191
Home Port: Osterville, MA


 
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 Post subject: Re: Starter and Starter Rebuild
PostPosted: 06 Feb 2019 22:02 
Offline
Skipper

Joined: 29 Dec 2006 09:38
Posts: 520
Mike wrote:
Jim, thanks... the glow plugs were the first thing I replaced. Some days the engine turns over really quick,,, other days it acts like the batteries are dead it's so sluggish... (by the way I have new batteries too).

thanks


I assume that you have checked all the connections. This seems like it could be a bad wire or connections if you have a sometimes fast other times lugging arrangement. Current flow can vary wildly based on temperature of a dying wire. Once I had a wire basically corrode almost to green/white powder several inches up the inside of the cable covering—the outside and the actual terminal looked fine. Took a bit of effort to find it.
FWIW. Occam’s razor here.

Ray Durkee


 
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